Date: Thu, 17 Mar 1994 18:37:45 EST From: Michael Montgomery Subject: New Genitive Pronoun? I would like to raise a query and propose a dissent to Larry Horn's characterization of the genitive relative pronoun _thats_ being a new or emerging form. The form as cited by Wayne Glowka is striking to many of us because it appears in writing, and it may be a form that isn't noticed by many until it does appear there. I have heard the form infrequently, but once a year or so, over at least the past decade, and my suspicion is that either it has been in vernacular English for quite sometime or that it crops up sporadically by analogy to _whose_. I don't think it is by any means new, and the discussion a couple of years ago on the Linguist List, when people in disparate locations attested it, is consis- tent with this contention. From time to time I notice a form or usage that seems entirely novel to me, only to discover that it is common in the speech around me (and sometimes that I use it myself!). We must be very careful in assuming something is new by virtue of our paying notice to it for the first time. There is such a thing as an "observer's illusion" as well as the better-known "observer's paradox." Are there other examples of this phenomenon that come to mind of ADSers? Wonder if DARE has any citations? Peace, Michael Montgomery